Are all posts being moderated in the Critique forum prior to them appearing in that forum on this website?
I posted a critique today, suggesting to the author that the poem would be stronger if the first and last stanza were eliminated.
My post didn't appear when I posted it. Instead, I got a message that the post would be reviewed by the management and a decision would be made as to whether it would be allowed to appear on the site.
A few hours later, I got an email that stated that my post was not posted, the management having rejected it.
My critique was valid and honest and kind. I was trying to be helpful to the author. I have no idea why my critique was rejected and not posted on the site.
I'm just wondering whether every member of the site's posts to the Critique forum are being moderated like that and if so, why?
And if that's not the case, I'd like to know why my posts are being singled out for moderation and why that particular critique didn't appear on the site, having been rejected by the management for posting.
Thanks for your help with my question, whoever can help.
As long as your critique meets the three rules it will be approved. I did send you a message to let you know why your critique wasn't approved. You didn't meet the minimum length for a critique (fifty words). I suggested that you add an explanation/clarification to your comment in order for it to be more helpful to the poet.
Sorry, I didn't see your explanation. I just looked back and found yesterday's email and read it.
When brevity and succinctness are such effective writer's tools, seems putting a minimum word limit on a critique doesn't really make much sense. I could expand on it, but I'd just be repeating myself. But maybe I'll take the time to try. I really didn't have much more to say about it other than I think the poem would be stronger without the first and last stanzas. Why? Because it was repetitive and because brevity and succinctness are strong tools!
How many words is that? (hah.. I don't have a word counter. I don't think any of my software apps counts words. I don't use Word). I guess I'll have to count them after I type them and add more if there aren't fifty.
This will be a good exercise for me as I'm working on both a book report and an essay for school with a minimum number of pages required. Being a person who quite easily can ramble on and talk a lot, I suspect I'll be able get up to 10 pages but it's going to be tough not being repetitive.
The one critiquing the poem needs to meet the small minimum of fifty words only once in a thread, in the initial critique. Anything else added to the thread is "extra" as far as that minimum is considered. The times vary; it could be approved (or disapproved) in a few minutes, a few hours or a few days. As far as the decision, that was mine. I saw too many people posting poems frequently and not even giving any comments on other people's pieces, or if they did comment, give short one-liners without explaining anything or giving any insight. That is not "critical". The minimum of the three rules for posting helps keeps the "Critique" forum an actual critique forum, or at least a closer likeness to one.
As far as the decision, that was mine. I saw too many people posting poems frequently and not even giving any comments on other people's pieces, or if they did comment, give short one-liners without explaining anything or giving any insight. That is not "critical". The minimum of the three rules for posting helps keeps the "Critique" forum an actual critique forum, or at least a closer likeness to one.
Admin.. why is nothing being done.. about this. so many people just dropping off their poems and not staying long enough to make a comment on other people's pieces.. what are you doing about it?
But if one can tear to pieces the work of a poet as one can the body of a god, one cannot kill her voice. from Edith Mora, "Sappho: The Story of a Poet", Flammarion, 1966
May I suggest that the title of the forum be changed to "Critique - All Posts are Moderated"
And that on this thread where the rules for critique are ( viewtopic.php?f=25&t=14137 ), it is clearly stated to the members that their posts will be moderated prior to appearing on the site to make sure they're following the rules.
Otherwise, people don't know this. I didn't know until I tried to post there. I initially thought ALL my posts on the site were being moderated which sort of made me wonder why!
Nobody will know unless you tell them. If they receive a rejection via email that they've not followed the rules and their post will not appear on the site, it could make them feel like their thoughts aren't welcome on that forum, unless they know in advance that specific rules must be followed in order to post there.
Also, the rules and post moderation may inhibit people from posting there at all and already that forum has had very little participation because of the encouragement of argumentative critiquing in the Poetry Zone (unlike the rule in the Critique forum which clearly states that respect is one of the rules).
Also, may I make a suggestion that the Critique forum be moved up higher on the board, perhaps as the TOP forum in the Poetry section with the Poetry Zone being second. If this is indeed a site which not only encourages but supports all types of critique, then the critique forums should take center stage. If not the top forum, I suggest that at least it appear right underneath the Poetry Zone as the second forum in the Poetry section.
I also suggest that the SAME rules apply to the Poetry Zone, as it is essentially a critique forum itself. Rules in one forum that don't apply to another which accepts and encourages critique doesn't quite make sense, in my humble opinion.
Just some ideas from a caring observer in the audience who has invested over 6 years participating at this website.
I fully expect that my ideas won't be entertained but that's all right.
Tssskkk Doreeen don't get snippy. Give it a chance, yes?
Having said that:
While I think this a brave and worthwhile experiment (Admin - good for you ) . I did experience the same confusion that Doreen mentioned regarding information. I learned of the introduction of the new system only when I pressed the send button. My immediate thoughts and actions:
1 Oh shit what have I done to rile Admin? 2 I must have used a bad word 3 Eeeek I must have accidentally posted the link to that porn site I was just checking out 4 Hot flush 5 Oh, wait, maybe it's just coz I haven't posted for some time 6 Wait again, it might not be me at all, it might be a general requirement 7 I can't see a notice saying it's a general requirement 8 I wonder if applies to other forums 9 Let's go and test 10 Something innocuous in Poetry Zone maybe 11 Ah yes Japanese Wind's lil poem - repy "testing testing" 12 No that might be rude, scratch that 13 Reply "Nice poem" 14 Conscience: "But you didn't read the poem" 15 Me: "So what ffs - it's just the Poetry Zone and JW" 16 Conscience: "But you've never posted to a poem without reading it before" 17 Me: "Liar, what sort of a conscience are you!?" 18 Conscience: "Fine, be like that, do what you want, ask sub-conscience if you like, see if I care." 19 Me: "Sub-conscience? You going all BDSM on me?" 20 Conscience: "Hilarious, very funny, not - sulk." 21 Posted "Nice poem" 22 It posted immediately. 23 Problem solved, all clear.
Conclusion: It would be good to have a clear notice of the moderating system somewhere - it isn't even mentioned in the "Rules for Posting" sticky.
The biggest drawback of this system for me is the inability to immediately edit or change after I posted. Especially when critiquing I tend to want to make changes just as soon as I hit that submit button - and more often than not I'll think of something I want to add several hours later. Mind you, I'll just have to keep a copy of everything I post and resort to multiple posts if I want to change or add stuff I guess. Not complaining - just saying.
The only other small nit is that if reponses take "days" to approve it might lead to unecessary angst. For instance, had my apology to Doreen not appeared within 24 hours I would have been fretting that she thought I was being rude and ignoring her. And right now she might be trying to respond to my apology with a nice kiss and a hug, and the said kiss and hug are administratively stuck thus depriving me of a virtual quasi-erotic experience, and causing Doreen (laid back and patient though she is ) some momentary agitation.
Hah! Rob... that was a wonderful post! You made me smile, grin and giggle. Of course I knew you weren't trying to offend me and I'm replying here because I don't want to wait a few days for my post to appear on the Critique forum. Here's your (((hug))) an a on yer cheek and another on your forehead. (smile) ... It's great to see you!
I DID think you were trying to say (damn this text stuff) that both my poetry and Ginsberg's poetry is usually too long for your taste. That's a concrete statement and I wasn't offended. I DO (well I used to more often than I do now) tend to write some long pieces.
I've not been a huge fan of Ginsberg through the years mainly because (and this might be a stupid subjective reason), but mainly because I've read in his poems about his fondness for underage boys and therefore I just stopped reading him. Was that fair in regards to literature? I don't know but information like that turns me off and effects me negatively. This could extend into an entirely separate conversation about whether we allow an artist's personal life to affect how we evaluate their art. Thing is, Ginsberg didn't keep them separate. He often wrote about the underage boys. Don't get me wrong. I'm totally NOT homophobic. I think being gay is as natural for some as being heterosexual. But should I allow his taste for young, underage boys to affect my taste for his art? I don't know.
That said, I LOVED loved loved the recent bio called HOWL -http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1049402/ If you haven't seen it, I highly recommend it. James Franco did a fabulous job playing Ginsberg and I learned more about Ginsberg's life than I ever knew, plus gained a whole lot of respect for him.
Anyway, back to reality. ("I'll only go as a tourist" - Jason Robards, A Thousand Clowns).
It's great to see you! Are you packed for Aruba yet? We missed last year's trip so we need to ramp it up and get prepared for this year's trip. Bring your wife, your bongos, and your poetry! It'll be a blast!
AND... I also agree (as I said above), that some type of notification should be made to the members of the site that their posts are being moderated prior to appearing, not just finding out through trying to post and getting the notification then which makes us wonder WHY! (Your list was tres amusing! *brava* giggle) Isn't it great to agree on something? Rob and Doreen agreeing! Amazing! Gotta love it. LOL
I didn't get email notification that my post was approved, btw, so I had no idea that it was showing on the site and I had no idea that you had replied to it until I just happened to stop by here and take a look.
"Poetry is everywhere, just waiting to break out." — Craig Moore
First, it's totally not cricket to give me kisses in one line and then remind me about the wife a few lines later! And, uh, why would I want to bring her to Aruba with you there?
Second, we always disagree? lol I don't think so, well not till now. I disagree that I disagree with you often or even much; mainly what happens is that you think that I'm disagreeing because you take my weird sense of humour as, well, what I really think, which I don't, well most of the time anyway ...
Third, umm, I forgot the third ~sigh~ age age ugh
No I don't mind long poems, but your poems, and usually Ginsberg's, sustain the interest, Atmos's didn't for me.
I do prefer yours to Ginsberg's and I prefer you to Ginsberg, given that you probably don't like underage boys. Seriously though, unlike most artist types I certainly DO believe that it's understandable and valid to let what you know of someone's personal life colour your view of their work. I don't think you can divorce the morality of one from the other. Well I can't anyway. Having said that I would want to know a lot more about Ginsberg's life before presuming to make judgements. Thanks for the link to imdb.
Anyway I'm still flushed and happy from having got an 'old' Message Board hand like you to actually giggle. Heh.
Thanks for all your nice words, it's good to be looking in again, life has been "messageboardless" for a long while, and I missed it.
You'll be relieved to know that I am long out of my fondness for underage boys phase, well, ever since I was one at boarding school to be precise , but we won't go there, not in full view of the crazies in your bible belt anyway!
I will smile for the photo I promise, but you know what, and this is something I am sure is universal, however hard you smile in those photobooth thingies, you always end up looking like you were just released from Alcatraz. What's that all about? Convinced it's a plot by the booth manufacturers to make you go right back in again to try another.
LOL, at the vid link, that's the third time you posted it and the second time I watched it, and it always makes me smile
What SFP do you think for Aruba? Remember I am of Norse origin, fair as fair can be.